Game Mod Discussion at Carl's Sims 3 Forum

[xFezIsAFreakx]

I also agree. Plus, the person could be speaking of a mod that isn't very wellknown and/or trusted and then the person could take their advice before someone else steps in to tell them different.

[Serena Darrin]

Why not make this a rule? When helping with Tech issues, everyone should always suggest a mod free solution first?

I like this.  As much as mods can help an honest game bug, there are often other things too.   Sometimes, your game will even fix itself on a restart.

That, and sometimes, a bug-fix mod can conflict with another mod (had that happen once), so the last thing you want is 'here!  Take this mod, it will fix your game!' only to have it conflict with a mod that person's already running, and break their game even more.  Posters here won't know what mods (if any), people are running, (and I wouldn't expect them to know!).  If the first choice for fixing problems is not using mods, that will mean much less potential for those kind of conflicts between mods.

I also agree. Plus, the person could be speaking of a mod that isn't very wellknown and/or trusted and then the person could take their advice before someone else steps in to tell them different.

Ah, yes, I hadn't thought of that, but true.  If mod-free help is supposed to be the first step, then its likely that if/when a mod gets suggested, it will (hopefully) be a mod that is better known.

[xFezIsAFreakx]

Oh yes, I had completely forgot that some mods will conflict with others. That could be a big problem we'd all need to be really wary of in the new board.

[grimsoul]

The only negative thing I could really see coming out of this is if someone is having a technical issue, a mod may frequently come to be the first answer. This is good for people who are willing to use mods, but if there is an unmodded way to fix the problem, that's the answer I would like first.

I agree, If there is a way to help with a problem without using a mod that should diffidently be the first option.
Just like the bug where you couldn't dig the excavation sites in WA, there was a mod to fix it but there was also a way to work around it without the use of a mod. I choose the work around instead of using a mod for it.

[Serena Darrin]

Oh yes, I had completely forgot that some mods will conflict with others. That could be a big problem we'd all need to be really wary of in the new board.

It's one of the problems that does come with playing a modded game.  Both the mods can be totally safe, but put them together and they can cause problems because they're both trying to modify the same thing.

A reputable modder will post what files/resources their mod alters; so with some research you can usually keep conflicting mods to a minimum, but sometimes something will surprise you -- and core mods alter a lot. (That's why they're 'core' mods, because they change so much in the code of the game).

There are tools to help find if your problem is related to conflicting mods, too.  They're not perfect, but a good resource.

And, at the end of the day, mods can just be pulled out (with one or two exceptions, but they're still an easy uninstall), so if your mods are giving your problems, it's not hard to get rid of them.

Might I suggest making a sticky thread of major mods and people's experiences on the new Mods section?  That way, the community here can get information on specific mods, and know which ones to avoid.  (This might have been suggested before.  If so, I apologize, it's been a long day and I've still got studying to do.)

[Carl]

I'm sure this perception of a future issue with mod-only solutions coming up all the time is exaggerated. People will still hear what's available based on what is known by their fellow members. We assume everyone will be lazy and just throw up a mod solution for a problem, but what if that's the reason mods are made that fix bugs? Often another solution doesn't exist. I doubt people who can create them would do so if there was already an easy fix available. They must be incredibly time consuming to create. However, I am sure that there are mods that can correct multiple issues that will be brought up frequently. People should know of the mod option, and the poster who wants to share this shouldn't have to wait on a mod-free solution before doing so. A lot of people will be happy to hear of a quick fix. I think the few who are insistent on a mod-free fix should state so themselves within their question. People in the future who encounter that same issue should know about both options. One of the reasons to allow speech like this is to open up the discussion here, bogging it down with restrictions and "guidelines" overly complicates things and censors people whether we like it or not.

[jeanamariex3]

I think this speaks volumes about the integrity of the members of this community and the high standards we hold for ourselves and each other.  That is the reason that I am so proud to be part of this forum.

I agree 100%! Even though you and I aren't moderators, we are still over the age of 18, and fairly tech savvy, and well experienced, and it is our responsibility to make sure, if any of our younger forum members choose to use any sort of game modification, they get the proper help they need, from experienced users like us. We should be setting an example for them. Some of the 18 and over forum members are also parents. Giving my help into what mods can help or hurt the game and what websites are inappropriate or not could make that forum member to a young child feel secure that their child won't get exposed. I would rather get banned from this community for posting an honest answer about what mods are out there and what websites are appropriate and what is not, than have the younger member not know what their doing, and casually googling "Sims 3 Mods" only to end up on an inappropriate website, and getting some sort of virus from that website.

Why not make this a rule? When helping with Tech issues, everyone should always suggest a mod free solution first?

That is a great solution. I still have the attitude, "if you don't want to use a mod, that's fine, mods aren't something to be thrown in your game casually..."

What made this forum the best, for me, was that mod discussion was not allowed, although I was aware that many people were using them. I feel this is better for the challenges that go on here.

The challenges will still require the game is 100% clean and mod free. I think not allowing this discussion hurt us. It brought us to shame (including me), turned our moderators into hypocrites by editing the posts and gave the 18 and older experienced mod users a sense of irresponsibility.

However, I realise that one or two (Esther) opposed to this will not alter anybody's opinions, especially as I am more of a lurker anyway. Although this probably will not be the case, I do worry that mod discussion will become more discussed in other threads too if it is allowed in one section of the forum, and that mods will be the main solution to bugs in the game.

I totally understand your concerned there, which will bring me to my suggestion of the rule. I think we need to have it include, "Do not casually discuss mods..."

This is probably just me being picky, though, at many people seem to be really happy with this change. It just seems really odd to be getting rid of such a well-established rule which made this forum completely family-friendly.

Like Nicky said, allowing mods will not make this forum less family friendly. To all forum members 18 and older that use game modification, it is our responsibility to make sure younger forum members not only do not take mods casually, but also make sure they don't run into a mod or website with adult content. To have them fend for themselves is unsafe and irresponsible on our part.

I'm sure any unsuitable Mods will not be allowed and that only trusted Mods and Makers will be discussed. Not only do so many people use Mods but it could be a real aid in discovering the reasons behind someones technical issues.

See this is where my only concern is. I'm really worried that we end up going from one extreme, "mods are bad" to another "mods are good." There should be a medium with this rule. Still keep in mind "do not use mods to break the T for teen rating," "mod's are very risky..." but with new rules like "all mods must have an actual source..." but still the good parts "yes mods can be helpful, and can really improve your game..." So in other words, instead of the rule "Do not discuss or share any links to mods. Period!" It should be "Do not discuss or share links to any mods casually." In other words, if you use a mod, you have to have the proper website. Basically I'm saying the rule should state: If you use a mod, you must provide a proper source.

As far as my use of Mods. I'm not using any and probably will not use any. Just because I don't feel comfortable taking that risk in my game.

I understand why you wouldn't want to use mods in your game. Mods, while they've given me improvement, are not something to be used in your game casually. In other words, you have to know the website and the creator. When we do change the rules, I think Carl should mention the statement I said above. If you want to use mods, that's your choice, but DO NOT TAKE MODS CASUALLY!

I think we really need to really let people know, if you chose to use mods, it's not something that you can throw in your game so casually, like a download from our Swap Shop. You need to follow the directions and understand what you're doing when using the mods.

I think saying "mods are bad" is misleading.

[twallan]

Not necesarrily. If you see this Thread, you could in effect create two Sims 3 Games, one with Mods and one without.

Sorry, I did not qualify my remark properly : "Must forgo mod use while playing a challenge save-game"

[jeanamariex3]

I like this.  As much as mods can help an honest game bug, there are often other things too.   Sometimes, your game will even fix itself on a restart.

I can safely say de-Fragmentation on a hard drive is a great solution, on some bugs, along with a new graphics card. I remember playing on my Vista (still do) with a chipset and my game had so many issues. Some of the fixable bugs seem to go away by themselves.

[Anushka]

I also don't think that making additional rules about what should be offered as solutions should be first or second  There is rarely ever only one answer to any question, and whoever ask the question can easily ignore the mod solution and ask/wait/look for mod-free one, while everyone else could see all possible solutions, including the one with a mod.
Just last night I got choppy game all of the sudden, and spent more than 20 minutes trying all the things I could remember (even system maintainance and reg cleaning), but only thing that helped - and instantly - was a simple Reset All Objects. I gave up on my dynasty and only multigenerational family only to find out it could be saved - not for the Hall of fame, but for my own pleasure. It would be nice to know that things like that could be done and have a reliable and active place to discuss it.

As much as no mod talk/share policy didn't stop many of us in finding and using mods, allowing "mod talk" shouldn't force anyone to start using them. But talking about it should ease the communication and increase the helpfulness of our forum, and expand the game expirience.

[Carl]

I will try to cover the basics of using a mod and let people know that they can conflict with one another etc. in the disclaimer/rules type topic I will make for the board. Good suggestion.

On the mod solution for bugs discussion, I can see several of you supporting it and recognize that. I just really do not want to regulate things like this and let them come naturally. Plenty of people who mod their games realize that sometimes it's better to fix it without one. You'll still get the information that people have available to them when you seek help If anything we should be glad we can finally let the people who know of a mod to fix a problem speak up. That has been censored long enough and in removing a rule we do not want to create more. They can be barriers to the enjoyment of the forum, as this thread has proven.

[Frey]

Mods should definitely be the last option, but, if none of the other mod-free options work, then it's OK to use them, at least for me. Anyway, people asking for technical help who don't want to get suggestions about installing mod A or B because they don't want to take the risk, then I think it would be fair if they just said so in their own help thread. For instance, if anyone like me was having crashing issues and wouldn't like anyone to suggest to install ErrorTrap or Overwatch or whatever other mods out there, just make clear that you don't want others to suggest you to do so and that's OK. That way everyone is happy and comfortable and no one has to feel there is some sort of pressure for using mods.

Plus, Carl and the moderators probably already thought about this, but I think it would be good if there was a sticky thread in the Mods Board about what risks you run when you use them. That way people curious about mods who have never heard much about them can school themselves before deciding if they will be using them or not.

I see no reason to believe that this change will actually alter the forum environment. I believe that this forum is clean, tidy, safe (as any internet forum can be) and family friendly not only because we allow or don't allow the use of this and that, but because there is a strong cohesive moderator team that makes sure that the rules are followed. And as cool a mod can or cannot be, I doubt that they are that interesting to have us all discussing them in every forum thread available. It's just another normal topic that can be discussed reasonably when needed. That's my opinion, at least.

[Jancy]

I personally have never tried any mods ~ I've read about them here and there on other sites but I didn't quite understand the whole process from installing and uninstalling them on a Mac and wasn't sure of problems I may encounter after doing so.  They just seemed a bit overwhelming.  I think it will be interesting to actually learn and understand what they do, from here, where I feel comfortable asking questions even if it makes me sound like a complete newbee!
 
Lots of us will be learning together and that makes me feel like I may possibly give them a try especially if they help with game performance.  If not, I will certainly learn about them. 
 
I am happy to know though I can stay right here (not that I was going anywhere) and learn the in's and out's, pro's and con's!

I am also quite happy to know that the Swap Shop will remain CC free.

[samoht04]

Yeah, I've looked at Mods and I don't exactly understand what any of them really do or what features they affect. It might be useful if there was a list of the top mods or something with their features - maybe info on what bugs they can sort as well?

[jeanamariex3]

Wow, This thread has really grown sense I check last. It's nice to see I'm not the only one that uses Mods here and I can come out of the closet about it. 

I felt the exact same way. The fact that most of us followed the rule "No mods" and that we could never be honest about using them, as awful as it sounds, would be like all the people who participate in Metro's Tournaments religiously coming out of the closet about cheating. Neither one of the situations I applied are honest.

Yeah, I've looked at Mods and I don't exactly understand what any of them really do or what features they affect. It might be useful if there was a list of the top mods or something with their features - maybe info on what bugs they can sort as well?

This is exactly why we need to be open and honest. Part of having a friendly community means helping each other and answering these sort of questions you may have if you decided whether you want to use one or not. It's still your choice, and I would never want to (even as a closeted experienced mod user), force you into something you don't want to do. You're right to second guess yourself, and not feel comfortable, because whether you decide to use them or not and the fact that Carl went from "no mods" to "mods are okay as long as they're still appropriate" doesn't change the biggest most important rule about mods: do not throw them in your game casually!

I am happy to know though I can stay right here (not that I was going anywhere) and learn the in's and out's, pro's and con's!

You should be. One little rule should never force anyone to fend for themselves or go to a hostile environment on the internet. As much as I like, support, and most importantly respect, the rules of this forum, I believe the biggest rule of all, was written for the wrong reasons.

I also don't think that making additional rules about what should be offered as solutions should be first or second  There is rarely ever only one answer to any question, and whoever ask the question can easily ignore the mod solution and ask/wait/look for mod-free one, while everyone else could see all possible solutions, including the one with a mod.
 

As much as no mod talk/share policy didn't stop many of us in finding and using mods, allowing "mod talk" shouldn't force anyone to start using them. But talking about it should ease the communication and increase the helpfulness of our forum, and expand the game expirience.

This is why I think the new mod rule should state this: DO NOT casually discuss or link to any mods on this forum. Discussing casually means, you can simply say "you'll be fine there's nothing to worry about...just go to Google and type in Sims 3 Mods" when there IS a lot to worry about if you don't use it properly, or saying "oh I use this mod, but I can't remember where I got it from..." isn't exactly smart.

Maybe we should find a happy medium, so it doesn't seem like it's taking one extreme to another. So I think we should say this: "Mods can be great and help improve your game, but they're also risky, and shouldn't be treated casually. Whether you choose to use them or not is your choice. Just be careful when doing so..."

EDIT: I noticed that I've been saying the same thing over and over again about treating mods casually. I say this because I want everyone to know it's something you really shouldn't do.

EDIT 2 By Anushka - Capslock!